Posts by Separation of Powers

43

Is it all about the money?

by Laika in

often on this forum there are posts about how the gb are obsessed with money and some people here often suggest this impacts every decision the gb makes i.e.

on my holiday thread it was suggested jws aren't allowed to celebrate holidays as it means spending money on presents that they want for themselves.. i however, do not think this is at all true.

the society rarely talks about money and as a percentage of income i think the vast majority of jws contribute a very small amount simply because the society rarely talk about it.. obviously money is important to the society in the sense that they couldn't run a major organisation without it, so they have to ask for it at times and factor it in to some of their decision making, but actually the gb live quite frugally and seem to worry much more about clinging to their authority and power than getting rich.. my controversial suggestion of the day is that saying the gb are obsessed with money must make us look silly to lurkers.. what does the jwn intellegentsia think then?.

Separation of Powers

Someone other than the GB are worried about the money....But it seems to be all about the money.

51

The Good News of The Kingdom - Gods Plan for Salvation through the Ransom (Help Needed)

by objectivetruth in

when i first began studying in order to "make the truth my own", there were a set of scriptures that perplexed me and motivated me to dig deeper.. the scriptures are regarding the resurrection of the inhabitants of sodom & gomorrah.. see jesus words here - matthew 10:15 - "truly i say to you, it will be more endurable for the land of sodom and gomorrah on judgment day than for that city.

" (ezekiel 16:48 / matthew 11:23 / matthew 11:24 / luke 10:12 ).

any time that i brought these scriptures up to jw friends and family they would reply like this "jesus was speaking in hyperbole.. that is why he said it would be more endurable".. i would clarify and show them that it says "will be".

Separation of Powers

For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son....

If that is the case, if we are to believe that God, in fact, did that and that Jesus was indeed his Son. Then the rest of the scripture is all you need to know. "that whoever BELIEVES in him shall not perish but have eternal life."

No reason for a dissertation. It is plain and simple. Don't convolute it with positions and nuanced expositions. Accept it if you choose to.

SOP

51

The Good News of The Kingdom - Gods Plan for Salvation through the Ransom (Help Needed)

by objectivetruth in

when i first began studying in order to "make the truth my own", there were a set of scriptures that perplexed me and motivated me to dig deeper.. the scriptures are regarding the resurrection of the inhabitants of sodom & gomorrah.. see jesus words here - matthew 10:15 - "truly i say to you, it will be more endurable for the land of sodom and gomorrah on judgment day than for that city.

" (ezekiel 16:48 / matthew 11:23 / matthew 11:24 / luke 10:12 ).

any time that i brought these scriptures up to jw friends and family they would reply like this "jesus was speaking in hyperbole.. that is why he said it would be more endurable".. i would clarify and show them that it says "will be".

Separation of Powers

Is this a manifesto or something?

51

The Good News of The Kingdom - Gods Plan for Salvation through the Ransom (Help Needed)

by objectivetruth in

when i first began studying in order to "make the truth my own", there were a set of scriptures that perplexed me and motivated me to dig deeper.. the scriptures are regarding the resurrection of the inhabitants of sodom & gomorrah.. see jesus words here - matthew 10:15 - "truly i say to you, it will be more endurable for the land of sodom and gomorrah on judgment day than for that city.

" (ezekiel 16:48 / matthew 11:23 / matthew 11:24 / luke 10:12 ).

any time that i brought these scriptures up to jw friends and family they would reply like this "jesus was speaking in hyperbole.. that is why he said it would be more endurable".. i would clarify and show them that it says "will be".

Separation of Powers

If it was really all that important, don't you think JESUS would have said it more clearly?

Could it be that the translators wanted to make it difficult to understand so that people in religious power could twist and contort the meaning of scripture?

There is absolutely no difference between the ability the ORG has to interpret scripture and say it is the truth and the Catholic Church doing the same....resurrection and judgment day, both are the prods by which a religious person moves, one moves them to see their loved ones, the other moves them to see their loved ones...guilt and manipulation will move people to believe A LOT of stuff!

52

Not All Anointed Ones Alive Today Are Part Of 'This generation'

by OwnAccord in

where do they come up with this stuff?.

this is a topic on 'the other site'.

i actually called our bethel ny branch and talked to a brother on the writing committee, at writing correspondence.

Separation of Powers

Ludicrous

107

Will firing the DOs be the first step to a new Watchtower?

by Juan Viejo2 in

against my better judgement, i've decided to share the following as a response to guy pierce passing and the announcement of the elimination of district overseers later this year.. late in january (2014) i got an email from one of my contacts (a fader) who served at bethel for several years, but is no longer at wt hq.

he still has a lot of close contacts within the service department and in other departments at patterson and knows people in all of the ny offices.

i kept this email set aside on a flash drive and haven't shared it with anyone - figuring i'd publish an article about it later this year when i had more time to do it right.

Separation of Powers

Appointed= Anointed

Very clever...very clever indeed. The early Church had absolutely NO issues with the laying on of hands to appoint someone to a position of oversight. It was a symbolic gesture indicating that the "Lord" was behind the decision. If you take the account where Judas Iscariot was replaced, it was a simple casting of lots. Yes, one of the most important decisions in the history of the Christian Church was made with a roll of the dice!

That being the case, there is nothing that leads me to believe that a decision as important as the appointment to the GB should be made any differently. If the "laying of the hands" meant divine appointment...then why not make the "anointing" by "appointing."

Biblical precedent? The words of Jesus to Peter, "whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven..." If Peter had the authority of the keys of the Kingdom and the current GB are actually MORE IMPORTANT than Peter according to the recent Faithful and Discreet Slave interpretation, then logically, THEY can anoint with Holy Spirit just as well as the Almighty.

I actually believe that this aspect of the email may well have some merit.

SOP

28

What do you think are the future doctrine changes will be?

by thedepressedsoul in

the whole organization is going through huge and big changes.

it can be seen by names of departments, to how things function and teaches.

my questions to you is, what do you think the future changes will be, both in teaching and organizational matters?.

Separation of Powers

Ok, I'm back. This is what I forsee. This is supposition just like when we use to go out in service and ramble about upcoming changes, nothing more.

144,000- No longer really matters as Sir82 so eloquently pointed out. It is a no-brainer. Get rid of the acutal number or else just minimize any importance to it and those that partake....they have no say anyways.

DO and CO- Well, call me the prognosticator of prognosticators cause I just read a letter that totally obliterates the DO arrangement!!! Now, with regard to the CO's? Well, the NEW school for Christian couples or whatever in the world it is called, requires that the couples who attend are capable of providing financially for themselves. This is an interesting requirement. It means that if you attend the school and are ready to be used "wherever there is a need" then why not in the Circuit work! Yes, these "financially independent" couples will be the next wave of CO's. And you know what, they will work for free! Nothing but the accolades to keep them going! Money saver indeed!

Publications- A new, easy to understand study book for new ones desiring to learn the "truth" may be published. This will ensure an influx of capital as it will take the place of every other study book. It will also be silver in color like the revised NWT and lovingly called the "silver dagger" or as it will jokingly be called, "the silver shank." The book will be pushed harder than the Truth book of the past, but a new referendum will accompany it, namely, the six month rule. In other words, as the ORG did with the Truth book, with much success I must add, the six month-your baptized-or-your out will be implemented. It will spur on the active with urgency and the hangers-on with a sense of impending doom. It WILL BE A SUCCESS mind you, just you wait.

GB expansion- The GB will grow in numbers. With the demise of the DO position, many long time DO's may be considered for GB and interestingly enough, there may be an increase in those who partake from this very group. This will enable them to not have a break in service while still promoting the cause.

SOP

28

What do you think are the future doctrine changes will be?

by thedepressedsoul in

the whole organization is going through huge and big changes.

it can be seen by names of departments, to how things function and teaches.

my questions to you is, what do you think the future changes will be, both in teaching and organizational matters?.

Separation of Powers

Hey theDS,

I respectfully disagree with a few on your expectations! Here are the reasons why:

1) 1914- They are actually ramping this up. With the coming DC they are CELEBRATING THE 100 YEAR ANNIVERSARY! There is no intention to distance themselves from that date. It is a divine date, an oracle approved date, the only date in the 20th century that will ever mean anything to them.

2) Disfellowshipping- Although it would be nice, the ORG is looking to intensify the SPECIALNESS (if that's a word) of the rank and file. TO do so, they must marginalize some among their ranks...it's the old "they were not of OUR sort" mentality. Sure, they think that they are special, but the world thinks they are loonies. So, how do you remain special? You ostracize those among you who have faltered who at one time thought they too were special and then watch them as they jump through the hoops to get back into the SPECIAL mix! No, disfellowshipping is the psychological tool by which the masses are kept in line!

3) Elders- I think you are on point here. With the advent of multi media capabilities at the DC and upcoming CA's, the venerable GB will be able to have their faces plastered on HD screens throughout the world! If that doesn't sound like something out of the Wizard of OZ, I don't know what else would. Yes, the elders will continue to plug along and fewer and fewer will get their due by giving talks at the assemblies which will make the upper crust of the elder elite even more "upper crust." Unfortunately, that will breed a disgruntledness that wasn't noticed before in elder bodies as there will be fewer and fewer carrots and the new wave of CO's will be hardliners with no real life experience or compassion. It will be slow...It will be painful...

4) The END- Ahh, the end. I don't agree with this so much. There HAS to be an end! Hope is an amazing thing, as it outweighs every other formal thought process. Give them hope and they will go on. There is an excellent quote by a man named Giroux, he said,"I can understand pessimism, but I don't believe in it. It's not simply a matter of faith, but of historical evidence, JUST ENOUGH TO GIVE HOPE, because for hope we don't need certainty, only possibility." THAT possibility is all they need. Yes, the END is right around the corner, unfortunately it is a LONG block.

SOP

24

Do any ex JW' s/ God believer's, Agnostics or Atheists believe in Karma? And WHY?

by rip van winkle in

just reading a thread and the mention of karma popped up.

( it happens, lol).

a lot of people believe in karma: what goes around comes around.. some months ago, while on another exjw site, karma was mentioned and i thought it a little odd, as they are atheist.

Separation of Powers

Depends on your interpretation or definition of Karma. If, like a traditional Buddhist, you believe that every cause has an effect, than yes, as an agnostic I firmly believe that. It is, in fact, a widely held belief among most belief systems. Among Islam, Judaism, and Christianity, there is the "reap what you sow" mentality. For strict Buddhists, that is all karma is.

If, on the other hand, you believe that karma means that if you do something bad, then something bad is going to happen to you, then I would say no. Case in point, many politicians and many of the uber-wealthy consistently do things that someone would deem as "bad," yet, they continue on with the status quo. This would mean that the notion of karma is not accurate.

If, however, you believe that ULTIMATELY what you do in your life adds to your overall contentment and/or suffering, then karma is the reason.

Just a thought,

SOP

21

Ever feel like you were faking it as a JW when you weren't?

by punkofnice in

i guess this is cognitive dissonance calling loud and clear!.

i remember being proud to be a jw yet at the same time i felt that i was just fooling myself.. i think this also applies to the stupid doctrines of the watchtower(r).......they made sense but at the same time they didn't.. i had secret self loathing for not being 'zealous(tm)' enough but on the other hand i didn't.. seems to me i had a separation of authentic persona from cult persona.. anyone else get this?.

Separation of Powers

Part of the delusion is to convince yourself that what you are doing will merit "life eternal." Another part of the delusion is that you are not doing enough, so you are constantly striving to do more. Because those around you are suffering from the same delusion, everyone puts a smile on their face and acts like life is peachy. The fact of the matter is...life is not peachy. The routine and its monotony begin to eat at the very fiber of your individuality and you are never the same.

Your life becomes a shadow, detached from your true persona. You are part of the collective, what you do is what you ought to have done!

Guilt and shame, shame and guilt, a vicious cycle that serves to break your spirit.

SOP